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 Post subject: Coins, Metals, Gems, Mining, and the Economy (or lack of it)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 7:04 am 
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Celeborn, here is your 'current' coin system, correct?
Quote:
1 white shard = 100 emeralite coins
1 emeralite coin = 100 adamantium coins
1 adamantium coin = 100 platinum coins
1 platinum coin = 100 gold coins
1 gold coin = 100 silver coins
1 silver coin = 100 copper coins
1 copper coin = 10 copper bits


Here are some problems I see with it, and some proposed modifications.

1. First of all, it introduces "materials" that don't exist currently in the game. Why use platinum when we can use Mitrill? Why use copper twice, when we can use iron? How about something more like this?

1 emeralite coin = 100 meteorite coins
1 meteorite coin = 100 adamantium coins
1 adamantium coin = 100 mitrill coins
1 mitrill coin = 100 gold coins
1 gold coin = 100 silver coins
1 silver coin = 100 bronze coins
1 bronze coin = 10 iron bits

This uses all the materials commonly avalible in the realm of metals. It also puts a raw value of each metal compared to each other.


2. Why not make coins and ingots interchangable? Each material could be had in several sized pieces.

1 talon = 10 bars
1 bar = 10 ingots
1 ingot = 10 coins
1 coin = 10 bits

talon 100 pounds
bar 10 pounds
ingot 1 pound
coin 1/10 pound
bit 1/100 pound

In this way you would make it easier to move and store larger quanities of metals. Using the same conversion between metals 1 Talon of Silver would be worth 100 Bronze Talons, or 1000 Bronze Bar. Rarity of mined metals could be adjusted to the same rates. In short, metal suddenly has intrinsic value, and not just value as resource.



3. Construct some kind of "universal bank" that allows the exchanging between metals. If the bank has no silver left, you can't trade in your bronze for silver. If the bank has to bronze left, you can't trade your silver for bronze. If there is not adamantite to be had, the changers aren't going to suddenly create some. In short, market rarity directly effects your ability to exchange.

Bank would take a percentage of "fee" for exchanging between metals, possibly about 20%. This would slowly increase the bank's pool of resources. A smaller fee would be charged for changing between forms of 'bullion' such as from a Talon to 1,000 coins. You might only get 950 coins from your Talon as part of the fee. Once again, that raw metal is added to the banks pool, allowing it to exist.


4. Gems? Where do gems fit in? Current gems are a bit mixed as far as value. Obsidian? Hah! thats a rock not a gem.... I would concider something like this instead?

Blue Diamond, Diamond, Ruby, Emerald, Tanzanite, Sapphire, Garnet, Citrine, Topaz, Opal, Lapis, Beryl, Peridot, Amethyst, Tourmaline, Jet, Spectrolite..... the list goes on....

All these gems are different, and not nessacarily better. In Folklore, Legend, Healing Properties:


Spectrolite brings forth each person's strengths, originality, aids sleep, relate to others.

Lapiz strengthens total awareness, creativity, ESP, skeleton, thyroid, helps to expand viewpoint.

Opal aids inner beauty, faithfulness, and eyesight and helps recall past lives.

Topaz was thought to heal both physical and mental disorders and prevent death during the middle ages. The Greeks believed it had power to increase strength and to make its wearer invisible while the Romans believed it had power to improve eyesight. The Egyptians wore it as an amulet to protect them from injury.

Meteoric iron is used for alignment and balancing; it symbolizes the aptitude and strength required for endurance. Nickel is thought to purify the blood and increase the body's iron content.

Peridot is thought to bring the wearer good luck, peace, and success,. Its powers include health, protection, and sleep. The advantages of peridot are to attract love and calm anger while also soothing nerves and dispelling negative emotions.

more at
http://www.bernardine.com/gemstones/gemstones.htm

Could we not take and somehow make gems actually DIFFERENT from each other instead of just better or worse then each other? Make them have different properties, intrisic abilities, and/or benefits to wearing. Stablize the enchant difference between gems to be much more close.


Anyway, these are some of my thoughts based on the recent topics.

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Thane Ezbad,
The Circle of Steel


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 7:35 am 
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On another note, since resources and money would be one and the same (for metals, atleast) you would not need to charge any coin for crafters. By using the metal you are basically 'destroying' money.

Larger pieces could be made for other materials

Fabrics
1 ream = 10 bolts
1 bolt = 10 yards

Leather
1 hide = 2 sides
1 side = 2 quarters

Wood
1 Cord = 100 plank

Exchanges could then be made to the silver standard. Certain fabrics and woods extra... could be worth more or less.

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Thane Ezbad,
The Circle of Steel


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 7:41 am 
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Anyway, back to lurking in the shadows.... unseen and hidden from knowing eyes. You never know who that newbie might be do you?

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The Circle of Steel


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 8:46 am 
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Not sure about the gems part; but the rest of it looks very good. I'd like to see it implemented along with the upcoming patch.

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 Post subject: Re: Coins, Metals, Gems, Mining, and the Economy (or lack of
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:29 am 
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Vogar Eol wrote:
1. First of all, it introduces "materials" that don't exist currently in the game. Why use platinum when we can use Mitrill? Why use copper twice, when we can use iron? How about something more like this?


Its a concept note, on testport Platinum isn't used, and copper bits are just bits.

Vogar Eol wrote:
2. Why not make coins and ingots interchangable? Each material could be had in several sized pieces.


They will be! Aft-patch resources actually have considerable coinage value, so trading at shops which stock resources is possible.

Vogar Eol wrote:
3. Construct some kind of "universal bank" that allows the exchanging between metals. If the bank has no silver left, you can't trade in your bronze for silver. If the bank has to bronze left, you can't trade your silver for bronze. If there is not adamantite to be had, the changers aren't going to suddenly create some. In short, market rarity directly effects your ability to exchange. Bank would take a percentage of "fee" for exchanging between metals, possibly about 20%. This would slowly increase the bank's pool of resources. A smaller fee would be charged for changing between forms of 'bullion' such as from a Talon to 1,000 coins. You might only get 950 coins from your Talon as part of the fee. Once again, that raw metal is added to the banks pool, allowing it to exist.


Shops do exactly this, including the fee due to lower-sell values, so no need to code an extra abstraction layer over it. :P Its not centralised, but i've been thinking about making a global shop-search command for things like this.

Vogar Eol wrote:
Could we not take and somehow make gems actually DIFFERENT from each other instead of just better or worse then each other? Make them have different properties, intrisic abilities, and/or benefits to wearing. Stablize the enchant difference between gems to be much more close.


When I finish the economy patch, the craft patch, AND the starsign/race patch, I'll consider this. ;)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 5:51 am 
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I say do away with coins all together! Bartering system!

---Avestifal

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 6:10 am 
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I agree with you about a barter system. My idea of different kidns of bullion and bullion in various ammounts is as close as I can think of a way of realistically creating a barter system.

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~Vogar Eol, Beater of Blades
Thane Ezbad,
The Circle of Steel


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 6:36 am 
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I would think that it would encourage people to craft sooner for their basic needs. And they could get things like Bullion (that's a spice right?I'm thinking Bullion Cubes here....) and then they could trade these spices (salt, pepper, thyme) to shop-keepers for items.

---Avestifal

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 7:04 am 
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Bullion as you are talking about is boiled down broth..... You add water and you have instant broth....

Bullion I am talking about is a name for a raw resource in its purest form, namely precious metals.

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The Circle of Steel


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2005 4:18 am 
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On the topic of coins....

I honestly don't think we should be giving every mob both coins and resources. It just doesn't make sense that you can kill any creature and get materials to make something, and also gain some coins on the side. Look at some examples.

Giant spiders. Why would these have any coins at all? In cocoons and corpses around them, yes. Spiders carrying coins on belt pouches? Spiders carrying treasure chests? No. Should spider exoskeltons be an expensive armour material? Maybe. Is spider silk the most expensive cloth? Maybe.

Dwarves. Should people be killing dwarves and making shirts from their hides? No. Should dwarves carry more coins and treasure, possibly even a few rare ingots? Yes.

Image

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~Vogar Eol, Beater of Blades
Thane Ezbad,
The Circle of Steel


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2005 1:11 am 
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Celeborn wrote:
When I finish the economy patch, the craft patch, AND the starsign/race patch
just how big is this economy patche and the others? What month do you think its going to be done ?
Zidane wrote:
im not rushing but it all looking interesting :D

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